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<p class="MsoNormal">I’m still not hearing a consensus as to whether the words ‘open source’ should be included in the mission statement or not.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">One or two observations:<o:p></o:p></p>
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<li class="MsoListParagraph" style="margin-left:0in;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1">W.r.t. licensing - the point I was trying to make is that the OFA cannot enforce (I don’t care if you call it ‘steward’ or ‘control’) license terms at all unless it controls what code
gets into the repo. Thus, as Doug notes, once the code went upstream, the old bylaws were no longer workable, and it doesn’t matter how much stewarding we did or didn’t do.<o:p></o:p></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="margin-left:0in;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1">What Doug said about kernel vs user is accurate, but moot. Correct?<o:p></o:p></li><li class="MsoListParagraph" style="margin-left:0in;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1">Looking forward, the question is whether we should include something in the mission statement and/or Bylaws that says that code developed under the auspices of the OFA (whatever that
means) is open source. I’m not hearing consensus between Jason and Sean on that point.<o:p></o:p></li></ol>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Can we agree that there should be no mention of licensing in the new Bylaws?<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">If so, what is the answer about a mention of open source in the mission statement/bylaws?<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">-Paul <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> Coulter, Susan K [mailto:skc@lanl.gov] <br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, March 15, 2018 12:49 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Doug Ledford <dledford@redhat.com><br>
<b>Cc:</b> Paul Grun <grun@cray.com>; ofa_boardplus@lists.openfabrics.org, <ofa_boardplus@lists.openfabrics.org><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Ofa_boardplus] OFA and Open Source<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Thank you Doug for pointing out kernel versus user space. <o:p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">You are correct that the rdma-core repo was and is clean - my bad there.<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">In fact, now that you remind me - you and Jason agreed to try and retain dual license in that repo. :)<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Perhaps it was Woody who said the kernel was tainted before we (the OFA board) fully took on discussing the dual license issue.<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">I know it was very clear to me early on that we had GPL-only code in the code base and removing it was a non-starter.<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">( hence my conviction that it was not introduced by moving the repo )<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Again, thanx for the correction/clarification.<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">On Mar 15, 2018, at 1:37 PM, Doug Ledford <<a href="mailto:dledford@redhat.com">dledford@redhat.com</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif">On Thu, 2018-03-15 at 19:07 +0000, Coulter, Susan K wrote:<br style="font-variant-caps: normal;text-align:start;-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;word-spacing:0px">
<br>
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif"><br>
In my opinion, the dual license issue is dead and has been for a while.<br>
What I mean by that is - the ship has sailed - regardless of how or why.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif"><br>
Agreed ;-)<br>
<br style="font-variant-caps: normal;text-align:start;-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;word-spacing:0px">
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif">It is my understanding from a recent side conversation that dual license was never really expected to hold.<br>
Dual license was agreed to early on to help the OFA members who needed and relied on it.<br>
It was more or less a given (amongst some) that as the code base matured and disseminated, it would be nearly impossible to retain.<br>
<br>
When Jason and company moved the code base from OFA to github, he immediately reviewed the state of the licenses.<br>
There were ~7 different licenses and we already had non-dual-license code in the repo.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif"><br>
I'm pretty sure the rdma-core repo is still dual license clean at this<br>
point. But, I could be wrong. In any case, it was really the kernel<br>
side where the lack of dual license is an issue. And there, the problem<br>
crept in a while back due to code contributions from people that<br>
specifically didn't want dual license.<br>
<br style="font-variant-caps: normal;text-align:start;-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;word-spacing:0px">
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif">So …<span class="apple-converted-space"> </span><br>
It is a fact that dual license was broken before the repo was moved.<br>
The word “control” is pretty strong; we probably should use “steward”.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif"><br>
Yes, steward is much better. And in that context, it's easier to<br>
understand why the dual license in the kernel was impossible to<br>
maintain. When someone writes code that significantly improves upon<br>
existing code, and includes new code written from scratch in a new file,<br>
and places that code under GPL only, your stewardship is called into<br>
question when you refuse to accept was is clearly an improvement to the<br>
overall code base because it has a license you don't like but that is<br>
the preferred, accepted license for the kernel itself. This is why<br>
breaking the dual license was mostly inevitable once the RDMA code made<br>
it into the upstream kernel. Outside actors doing good work.<br>
<br style="font-variant-caps: normal;text-align:start;-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;word-spacing:0px">
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif">The OFA was, in fact, the steward of the code in the beginning and as it gained acceptance.<br>
Whether or not the OFA actually failed as a “steward” is not a question I can answer, but I am open to the fact that we may have been remiss.<br>
There are other OFA programs and processes that have atrophied and/or we were remiss in staying actively on top of.<br>
It is >possible< we missed a step somewhere.<br>
<br>
I’m not saying these things to flog ourselves, but to honestly look at our path.<br>
As my husband and I like to ask at critical junctures: “Where are we, how did we get here, and where are we going?"<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif">On Mar 15, 2018, at 12:50 PM, Paul Grun <<a href="mailto:grun@cray.com">grun@cray.com</a>> wrote:<br>
<br>
I want to find closure on one open source/dual license item discussed today.<br>
<br>
It seems that there is broad agreement in the value of open source. There is also some demand to continue to maintain dual licensing.<br>
In the early days, OFA code (called OFS) was maintained in an OFA repo created per the bylaws.<br>
Hence the OFA could enforce the dual license provisions because the OFA controlled the maintainer of that repo.<br>
<br>
But since OFS was open source, anybody could fork the repo and effectively deprecate the OFA repo, which is what happened.<span class="apple-converted-space"> </span><br>
Once the open source community made the choice to fork the code and assign maintainers, the OFA could no longer rigorously enforce dual license provisions, except by a gentleman’s / gentlewoman’s agreement.<br>
<br>
The OFA could not have prevented that from happening.<br>
There are reasons why the community chose to do so (e.g. dissatisfaction with an absentee maintainer or other reasons) that perhaps the OFA could address<br>
But at the end of the day, there is no legal agreement that would prevent that from happening if someone were motivated to do so.<br>
<br>
Hence, in my view, the notion of losing control is illusory, since no such control exists, because OFS was open source.<br>
<br>
Please educate me if this isn’t accurate.<br>
<br>
-Paul<br>
<br>
Advanced Technology Group<br>
Cray, Inc.<br>
Office – (503) 620 – 8757<br>
Mobile – (503) 703 - 5382<br>
<br>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif"><br>
================================<br>
Susan Coulter<br>
LANL / USRC / HPC-DES<br>
Network Lead<br>
(505) 412-6525<br>
Lokah Samastah Sukhino Bhavantu<br>
================================<br>
<br>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif"><br>
--<span class="apple-converted-space"> </span><br>
Doug Ledford <</span><a href="mailto:dledford@redhat.com"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif">dledford@redhat.com</span></a><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif">><br>
GPG KeyID: B826A3330E572FDD<br>
Key fingerprint = AE6B 1BDA 122B 23B4 265B 1274 B826 A333 0E57 2FDD</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black">================================<br>
Susan Coulter<br>
LANL / USRC / HPC-DES<br>
Network Lead<br>
(505) 412-6525<br>
Lokah Samastah Sukhino Bhavantu<br>
================================<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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