[Ofa_boardplus] XWG meeting minutes 11/29

[Jason Gunthorpe]

At LPC Chunk and Bart were specifically interested in testing verbs
based applications like NFS-RDMA and SRP. Not really a space that
overlaps with libfabric..

Jason

On Thu, Nov 29, 2018 at 05:34:09PM -0500, Doug Ledford wrote:
> You can use libfabric over TCP sockets, but it doesn't have the feel of
> RDMA hardware.  What I was going for was something that a user could do
> to emulate having the hardware.  This provides a platform for exploring
> all of the aspects related to RDMA, including things like configuration
> of devices, seeing how the OS reacts to the hardware, as well as
> programming *any* of the RDMA APIs.  This is why I was most interested
> in soft-iWARP or soft-RoCE.
> 
> On 11/29/2018 5:20 PM, Hefty, Sean wrote:
> > Woody wasn't referring to the verbs provider.  He was talking about using sockets over tcp.
> > 
> > RDMA != VERBS   !!!!!
> > 
> > If OFA still can't get this right, then, yes, there's no way anyone outside of the field is ever going to understand it.
> > 
> > OFA has already made the investment.  It's harmless, been available for years, and is free.
> > 
> > 
> >> You’re quite right Woody; I hadn’t thought of using libfabric with the
> >> verbs provider running over Ethernet.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Another approach is the ‘cluster on a laptop’ that I described.  That
> >> one uses KVM and standard enet virtual switches to create a ‘cluster
> >> in a box’.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> In either case, Doug’s point was that the OFA is in a position to make
> >> it easier for people to get exposed to RDMA in a harmless and zero
> >> cost way.  I think that’s something in which the OFA should invest.
> >> Fastest way I can imagine to accelerate the adoption of high
> >> performance networks.
> >>
> >> -Paul
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> From: Woodruff, Robert J [mailto:robert.j.woodruff at intel.com]
> >> Sent: Thursday, November 29, 2018 1:59 PM
> >> To: Paul Grun <grun at cray.com>; Jim Ryan <jimdryan at gmail.com>
> >> Cc: ofa_boardplus at lists.openfabrics.org,
> >> <ofa_boardplus at lists.openfabrics.org>
> >> Subject: RE: [Ofa_boardplus] XWG meeting minutes 11/29
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>> There’s no easy way to experiment with RDMA and learn about it,
> >> without buying h/w.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> This is not exactly true. With OFI, it supports RDMA and we have a
> >> sockets provider that people can use with any off the shelf Ethernet
> >> NIC to experiment and learn about RDMA.
> >>
> >> In fact, we have a lot of development internally that uses the OFI
> >> sockets provider for initial development and then later test and tune
> >> it on hardware accelerated RDMA NICs.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Woody
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> From: Ofa_boardplus [mailto:ofa_boardplus-
> >> bounces at lists.openfabrics.org] On Behalf Of Paul Grun
> >> Sent: Thursday, November 29, 2018 1:24 PM
> >> To: Jim Ryan <jimdryan at gmail.com <mailto:jimdryan at gmail.com> >
> >> Cc: ofa_boardplus at lists.openfabrics.org
> >> <mailto:ofa_boardplus at lists.openfabrics.org> ,
> >> <ofa_boardplus at lists.openfabrics.org
> >> <mailto:ofa_boardplus at lists.openfabrics.org> >
> >> Subject: Re: [Ofa_boardplus] XWG meeting minutes 11/29
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> A tiny nit – the second to approve the minutes was Christoph.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Another small-ish nit - People are dismayed at how hard it is to test
> >> things RDMA-related especially by newbies, complicated by the need to
> >> buy HW.
> >>
> >> I think it’s a little more than just testing.  There’s no easy way to
> >> experiment with RDMA and learn about it, without buying h/w.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Not-so-small nit - Gilad explained openRDMA doesn’t compete with the
> >> OFA. Rather it provides help for those wanting to use RDMA. They are
> >> not doing new development.
> >>
> >> Rather, Gilad asserted that OpenRDMA doesn’t compete with the OFA
> >> because it is not doing new development. This is incorrect because the
> >> OFA’s mission is not limited to development.  Our mission is to
> >> accelerate the development and adoption of (e.g. RDMA).  No good
> >> argument was offered for why OpenRDMA should not be hosted by the OFA
> >> under the auspices of the existing OFVWG (which was originally
> >> requested by MLNX and is currently chaired by MLNX).
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> The OFA was originally formed specifically to foster the development,
> >> support, and adoption of RDMA and stands ready to continue doing so.
> >> Nothing about that has changed in our mission.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> -Paul
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> From: Ofa_boardplus [mailto:ofa_boardplus-
> >> bounces at lists.openfabrics.org] On Behalf Of Jim Ryan
> >> Sent: Thursday, November 29, 2018 12:30 PM
> >> To: ofa_boardplus at lists.openfabrics.org
> >> <mailto:ofa_boardplus at lists.openfabrics.org> ,
> >> <ofa_boardplus at lists.openfabrics.org
> >> <mailto:ofa_boardplus at lists.openfabrics.org> >
> >> Subject: [Ofa_boardplus] XWG meeting minutes 11/29
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> A very complex meeting, I hope I got it right
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Jim
> > 
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> > 
> 
> 




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